A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

For discussion of all aspects of the New York legends.
User avatar
iaredatsun
Now jelly rolls in the street
Posts: 1764
Joined: 08 Jun 2004 21:38
Location: London, Texas

A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by iaredatsun » 07 Jun 2015 20:57

I was surprised to come across this. 'Wall' - an outtake from Vintage Violence, added to the CD re-issue.

Not unlike his earlier 'New York in the 60s' material.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQnbUxfLF38
underground, overground

threechordwonder
Head held high
Posts: 321
Joined: 05 Aug 2008 22:27
Location: Berkshire, UK

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by threechordwonder » 09 Jun 2015 11:03

To my mind it does not sit neatly with the rest of the album, it's much too aggressive, shades of "Black Angel".

Maybe it's a warm-up improvisation that just happened to go down to tape, something to get the music flowing without too much effort. Or the band was late and JC was killing time.

Come along folks, let's have your theories.

Don't get me wrong though, it's good to hear the early stuff.

User avatar
taxine
Head held high
Posts: 1202
Joined: 27 Apr 2006 13:42

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by taxine » 09 Jun 2015 12:05

I've been a big fan of this reccord always,a sort of "brilliant serenity" feelin'.Might these "too aggressive"songs were originaly played -rehearsed for the LP but Cale get out them because of this very reason.....!!

Anyway, looking forward that early stuff and thanks for post it. :D
But there are no stars in New York sky, they're all on the ground.
This is the place where she lay her head when she went to bed at night....

User avatar
Sheila Klein
Head held high
Posts: 705
Joined: 15 Feb 2010 20:16

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by Sheila Klein » 09 Jun 2015 18:06

It sounds more like "Black Angel's Death Song" to me. But minus the song, so: "Black Angel's Death".

User avatar
iaredatsun
Now jelly rolls in the street
Posts: 1764
Joined: 08 Jun 2004 21:38
Location: London, Texas

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by iaredatsun » 10 Jun 2015 00:05

It sits right outside the album, which I do not think even noticeably features the viola. Completely at odds with the album.

It is definitely connects with Black Angel. Dream Syndicate, too with a folk or middle-eastern element, so also connects to Henry Flynt and Angus McClise.

If only he'd been able to make a whole album of this material. We can only speculate why it was recorded and whether it was actually at the same sessions. Is there more in the can?

Who is the world-authority on John Cale? There's also the question of whether another set of sessions exists with Terry Riley (aside from the Church of Anthrax) - unless I read Unterburger incorrectly.

Notes
All tracks recorded 1969.
Originally released in 1970.
Tracks 12 and 13 previously unreleased outtakes.
Mastered at Sony Music Studios, NY
underground, overground

User avatar
Mark
Head held high
Posts: 1122
Joined: 15 May 2004 21:13
Contact:

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by Mark » 10 Jun 2015 21:05

You're right, VV isn't a big viola album but it is on there - chorus of Gideon's Bible.
8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1

User avatar
iaredatsun
Now jelly rolls in the street
Posts: 1764
Joined: 08 Jun 2004 21:38
Location: London, Texas

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by iaredatsun » 11 Jun 2015 00:33

Mark wrote:You're right, VV isn't a big viola album but it is on there - chorus of Gideon's Bible.
I must be deaf. Anyhow, I wrote to the 'Fear Is A Man's Best Friend' website asking what was going on with that track. Not expecting any answers, mind you.
underground, overground

gazatthebop
Head held high
Posts: 317
Joined: 20 Feb 2012 13:33

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by gazatthebop » 07 Dec 2015 00:06

[quote="iaredatsun"]

Who is the world-authority on John Cale? There's also the question of whether another set of sessions exists with Terry Riley (aside from the Church of Anthrax) - unless I read Unterburger incorrectly.

quote]

Cale and Terry Riley recorded some songs together in 1994

User avatar
iaredatsun
Now jelly rolls in the street
Posts: 1764
Joined: 08 Jun 2004 21:38
Location: London, Texas

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by iaredatsun » 07 Dec 2015 02:15

gazatthebop wrote:
iaredatsun wrote:
Who is the world-authority on John Cale? There's also the question of whether another set of sessions exists with Terry Riley (aside from the Church of Anthrax) - unless I read Unterburger incorrectly.

quote]

Cale and Terry Riley recorded some songs together in 1994
I have never heard of that, and made so recently. Has anyone heard them?
Last edited by iaredatsun on 08 Dec 2015 22:56, edited 1 time in total.
underground, overground

threechordwonder
Head held high
Posts: 321
Joined: 05 Aug 2008 22:27
Location: Berkshire, UK

Re: A John Cale 1970 viola piece (Vintage Violence sessions)

Post by threechordwonder » 08 Dec 2015 20:18

Cale gets a mention in a book by David N. Howard called "Sonic Alchemy: Visionary Music Producers and Their Maverick Recordings" as producer of Nico, Stooges, Patti Smith, etc.

It was published in 2004 no-one has mentioned it on the forum. I have not read it so can make no recommendations.

Take a look: https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/ ... Sk0FNXkjcC

Post Reply