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Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 26 Mar 2019 22:40
by Wick Pick
lurid wrote: ↑26 Mar 2019 21:10
alfredovu wrote: ↑26 Mar 2019 20:37
The That’s The Story of My Life version with Cale on Viola is on Crawdaddy August 1968 issue (Inevitable pag 271)
Most if not all the 3rd Album was composed while Cale was in the band. Also some of the songs recorded for the Lost Album: I Cant Stand it, Foggy Notion, Move Right In, Ride Into the Sun. As i said in my previous post i know Ocean was recorded with Cale May 1968 at TTG studios.
From top of my head was Sterling who referred how good was the organ on What Goes On during the summer of 1968 live performances with Cale
Yes, Yule got Credits on Foggy, but the song was &rom the Cale days: Vibrations Sept 1968, San Diego Union June 15, 1968 both artcicles mention the song in their concert reviews
yes excellent research as always Alfredo. I also remember the Sterling quote about "WGO" but I can't remember the source. The writing credist for "Foggy" have always been very strange. Hy Weiss? I don't think we ever got to the bottom of that one.
I feel like it must be the UPTIGHT book as I've read that too.
Interesting stuff. I was thinking that we could eliminate the '68 date, and '66 seems so odd, but then I look at the other setlists from 1967 and the Poor Richard's setlist doesn't resemble any of them. The '67 setlists from April, May and August at the Gymnasium and the Boston Tea Party are all somewhat similar to each other. So it's a real anomaly, which just brings me back to the Poor Richard's in 1966 which is the real true anomaly of all their shows.
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 26 Mar 2019 23:20
by Elvis Plebsley
lurid wrote: ↑Hy Weiss? I don't think we ever got to the bottom of that one.
I'm sure that I read an interview in which Lou mentioned that Hy Weiss sued him for the writing credit for some lyrical borrowing. The 'Sally Mae's,' I think. Lou went on to say that he later got revenge by suing a band managed by Weiss for borrowing from Walk On The Wild Side.
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 02:15
by Sheila Klein
Just because the setlist was written on stationary from Chicago doesn't mean the set itself was played there. Is there any other evidence indicating that the set is from a Chicago gig?
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 07:19
by Kill Mick
Do we know who wrote the setlist (if it wasn't Reed)? Was it even member of the band? It seems very doubtful to me that the band would choose a gig in 66 that Lou wasn't at to play a load of previously (and subsequently for a couple of years) unheard songs written by Lou.
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 08:21
by alfredovu
The 3 songs published recorded at TTG in May were done on the 29th. The band was recording the previous day too, May 28th. They cut two song:
“Here Come The Waves” 3:20 With gtr, rhythm gtr, bass and drums
“ It’ s Gonna Rain Tomorrow “ 3:05 seems just an attempt, as there is no drums. Just two gtrs and bass. My guess this song is “Hey Mister Rain” but ...
That’ s all i know. Not as good and finished as the May 29th stuff? Could be, but i do not know why we have never seen these two cuts issued.
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 08:48
by alfredovu
Wick Pick wrote: ↑25 Mar 2019 22:53
lurid wrote: ↑25 Mar 2019 21:55
Well it did always seem to me a very strange set list for 1966.
It is true, if John was covering vocals for Lou and everyone else was switching instruments, wouldn't they play the songs they were most familiar with? But still they couldn't have been playing the Columbus setlist all year long, kind of surprised they were still playing a setlist like that by November...
Isn't I'm Not A Young Man Anymore mentioned as being played sometime in '66? With Nico on vocals? Anyone know what show that was connected with?
According to The Daily Californian Weekly Magazine Oct 10, 1967 (Inevitable pag 180 - sorry for the promotion...) the song was introduced by Nico at The Trip May gigs
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 11:09
by Wick Pick
alfredovu wrote: ↑27 Mar 2019 08:48
Wick Pick wrote: ↑25 Mar 2019 22:53
It is true, if John was covering vocals for Lou and everyone else was switching instruments, wouldn't they play the songs they were most familiar with? But still they couldn't have been playing the Columbus setlist all year long, kind of surprised they were still playing a setlist like that by November...
Isn't I'm Not A Young Man Anymore mentioned as being played sometime in '66? With Nico on vocals? Anyone know what show that was connected with?
According to The Daily Californian Weekly Magazine Oct 10, 1967 (Inevitable pag 180 - sorry for the promotion...) the song was introduced by Nico at The Trip May gigs
Great info, thank you! Do we know anything else about setlists from 1966? As far as I know Columbus is the only 'confirmed' full setlist we have from 1966, with just a few other songs mentioned here and there from other gigs.
In addition to Columbus, I've heard of these:
FILMAKERS’ CINEMATHEQUE, NEW YORK, NY, FEBRUARY 8-13, 1966
Venus In Furs
Heroin
I’ll Keep It With Mine
European Son (Suzie Q)
ARCHITECTURE AND DESIGN AUDITORIUM, ANN ARBOR, MI, MARCH 12, 1966
The Nothing Song
THE OPEN STAGE, NEW YORK, NY, APRIL 1-30, 1966
I’ll Be Your Mirror
Jam
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 17:14
by iaredatsun
alfredovu wrote: ↑27 Mar 2019 08:21
The 3 songs published recorded at TTG in May were done on the 29th. The band was recording the previous day too, May 28th. They cut two song:
“Here Come The Waves” 3:20 With gtr, rhythm gtr, bass and drums
“ It’ s Gonna Rain Tomorrow “ 3:05 seems just an attempt, as there is no drums. Just two gtrs and bass. My guess this song is “Hey Mister Rain” but ...
That’ s all i know. Not as good and finished as the May 29th stuff? Could be, but i do not know why we have never seen these two cuts issued.
Thank-you.
Interesting that you have such detailed information on those two tracks. None of this material is listed on the Verve sessions index for the year 1968.
Do you have similar details about the 5th July date recordings?
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 27 Mar 2019 19:32
by alfredovu
Regret to say no... I can tell you the info on the May 28th recording is accurate but this is only thing I have, the information.
Re: John Cale recorded five '3rd' album songs with VU?
Posted: 28 Mar 2019 09:25
by Low
About the Chicago setlist,
I think it's funny that both Foggy Notion And S. Mae is listed separately. Like it's two songs that later merged into one.
Also I Guess things happens might be Guess I'm falling in love, if I remember correctly there was a discussion years ago here at the forum
and that was one of the conclusions about the song.
The only other song I can think of that use the word 'guess' prominently is A Sheltered Life.
Weird if it IS from 66 and they already have the title for Mr Rain, but call it It's Gonna Rain Tomorrow in 68.